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Twin Peaks

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Offline Bamyasi
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« on: May 19, 2017 01:36 AM »
Anyone else excite?

Offline rtil
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« Reply #1 on: May 19, 2017 03:42 AM »
yes, although it's too bad some actors have passed away/retired and won't be in it, esp truman/fbi bromance

Offline rtil
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« Reply #2 on: May 19, 2017 03:53 AM »
also i grew up around north bend where most of twin peaks was filmed , mostly the black lodge, the falls and twede's. the abandoned railcar was destroyed. tourism will probably spike this year

Offline Bamyasi
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« Reply #3 on: May 20, 2017 03:11 AM »
Yeah really sucks that Ontkean won't be returning, considering he was pretty much the main character between Dale and Laura, and probably had the most important arc iirc. Also unfortunate about Miguel Ferrer.

I'm prepared for disappointment but cautiously optimistic I guess.

Weird how many revivals of actually decent things we've had recently. Trainspotting, Samurai Jack, now this.

Offline ExBerian
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« Reply #4 on: May 20, 2017 08:36 AM »
I wonder if they are going to try and continue it since its supposed to be 25 years later and all. Like was Dale just rampaging all these years or where his demons being suppressed all these years and are going to come out?

Also who is going to replace David Bowie?


Offline rtil
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« Reply #5 on: May 20, 2017 10:27 PM »
bowie was only in FWWM so idk if his character really needs to return. although i noticed some FWWM exclusive cast are returning so yeah. it can be really hard to predict what lynch will do. the nice thing about this return is that lynch and frost get to direct all the eps so it won't go on weird tangents like s2 did. my guess is that cooper has been in the black lodge for 25 years. idk how else you explain the timeskip

Offline Bamyasi
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« Reply #6 on: May 21, 2017 03:29 AM »
Can't wait to find out "How's Annie?"

"How's Annie?"

"How's Annie?"

"How's Annie?"

"How's Annie?"

Also the fact S2 was fucked with so heavily by ABC is proof serial live-action television is the hardest medium to succeed in and with Jews you lose.

idk how else you explain the timeskip

Offline rtil
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« Reply #7 on: May 21, 2017 03:55 AM »
right, i just mean how else do you cover the space of time between then and now. the best explanation imo would be that Coop was possessed by BOB in exchange for Annie's safety, and spent 25 years trapped in the black lodge. or something like that. lynch is the one who has the secrets of the log not me

Offline ExBerian
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« Reply #8 on: May 21, 2017 07:10 PM »
Or he has been in the bathroom laughing for the past 25 years and just now decided to come out of it.


Offline Bamyasi
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« Reply #9 on: May 21, 2017 08:21 PM »
spent 25 years trapped in the black lodge.
You were right but

Quote from: Lynch and Frost
Twin Peaks: The Return to South Dakota

Offline Bamyasi
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« Reply #10 on: May 22, 2017 08:09 PM »
Second and third episodes were better but anyone going into this series who was a fan of the old one should know anyone who wasn't a fan of the old one shouldn't go into this series, but also that it's a giant MGS2-style middle finger to anyone who was.

Pretty much everything that made the first series enjoyable (levity, tonal variance, exaggerated characters, idyllic small town charm by way of pretty television-style filming which misdirects you from sinister undercurrents, pretty celluloid cinematography, and cheesy synth pads) are pretty much entirely absent in the first four episodes. What remains is surrealism, hammy acting, violence and nudity. Again, pretty much a middle finger to everyone who enjoyed watching this with their family as a kid.

Offline rtil
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« Reply #11 on: May 23, 2017 05:11 PM »
who was letting their kids watch twin peaks in the early 90's? i didn't see it until i was much older and on my own time. not that my parents are the type to watch or enjoy twin peaks.

anyway i kind of disagree with your sentiments. the interactions between the scatterbrained old lady and her dog, the paranoid maintenance guy and the cops was classic lynch humor. the relationship between Bill and his wife is reminiscent of the soap-ish drama laced with a hint of mockery that Lynch loved to poke at in the early 90's when it dominated television. then moments of pure Lynchian horror sometimes appear without warning, reminding us that we're only one fire walk away from the demons of the Black Lodge.



my caveat is that the opening for s3 is far more bleak than its origins. we're not visiting the Double R Diner for some coffee and cherry pie any time soon, but i think that's appropriate. there's a lot more going on than investigating the murder of smalltown prom queen.

s3 is a lot bigger and far less comfortable universe than what fans would be used to, but all roads eventually lead back to Twin Peaks. i always remember when Coop said that someday when this is all over, he'd like to live there. i still think that he holds on to those sentiments, and i suspect that if he doesn't die that is the last place we will see him.

i'm also glad that s3 is not trying too hard to recapture every aesthetic of a tv series filmed 25 years ago. "Stranger Things" this is not - and i'm surprised anyone would expect  Lynch/Frost to reduce themselves to nostalgia-baiting. this is a story that they've waited far too long to tell, and they'll do it in their own way.

one other thing i did notice is the absence of music - i can only recall 2 or maybe 3 tracks throughout. i'd like to hear more soon, and i suspect we will. but what i did hear i liked. and i guess i should say i haven't seen eps 3 or 4 yet.
« Last Edit: May 23, 2017 05:13 PM by rtil »

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« Reply #12 on: May 23, 2017 07:57 PM »

Offline Bamyasi
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« Reply #13 on: May 24, 2017 12:11 AM »
Oh by kid I meant like 13 or 14 years old. I wasn't even born when this show originally aired. My dad had the DVDs.

I definitely didn't mean "middle finger" in a bad way. MGS2 is one of my favorite games. This definitely feels like a Lynch production, but as you said, it's way more bleak than I think the original show ever was, despite its subject matter. There's very little of the trademark lightness in the new one. All of the humor is either extremely dry/deadpan or black as hell, like the scenes you mentioned. Four people are brutally murdered in the first two episodes alone, and three of them on-screen. Part of this new feeling might come from Lynch and Frost not having to answer to any of the ABC studio execs who fucked the original show up.

I guess to be fair most of the humor in the original show for me came from the Horn family and obviously Cooper's interactions with the locals, and neither have really fully appeared yet. The difference is in tone but also aesthetics. In the original pilot the best gag is Cooper being overwhelmed by the flora and fauna, in the new one it's him/Bob KOing a gun wielding hillbilly with his bare hands in his introductory scene. In the original pilot Laura's body was wrapped in plastic and looked like a mermaid. In the new one we're greeted with multiple corpses and close-ups of entry and exit wounds.

I think a lot of the levity from the old show also came from how the beautiful Washington scenery was photographed, super idyllically to hide the demonic shit going on in the woods and behind the scenes. The new one looks and feels more like a Lynch movie by way of gritty digital television serial style videography, which David's sworn fealty to. The lack of Angelo Badalamenti's iconic score doesn't add much serenity. Also the fact that the small-town charm is entirely missing with the new almost agoraphobic scope. You put it well, it's less comfortable.

Also as you said, there's nothing nostalgia-baiting about this. It's just different. It's darker. I'd still call it a middle finger but it's also kind of a love letter. Everything I miss about the old show was probably intended to be missed. It's probably not how an S3 would've played out in the early 90s, but imo the studio's meddling (making them reveal Laura's "killer," neutering Cooper and Audrey's romance arc) probably would've made a satisfying conclusion impossible anyway. Anything as good as Twin Peaks was such a product of its time that recapturing the exact magic isn't even a worthy goal. It would've been predictable/cheap and these guys would never have done that, because it's not what their show was about.

Offline rtil
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« Reply #14 on: May 24, 2017 12:49 AM »
probably doesn't help that i've never played a metal gear game so i had no idea what you meant by the comparison. but yeah, it just goes to show how little of a fuck Lynch gave that fans hated FWWM when it came out. he can make us stare at an empty glass box for 10 minutes and get away with it  - and it was actually compelling. it's almost impossible to have expectations about Twin Peaks aside from the ethereal and supernatural reality of its universe. my favorite thing about it is how unapologetic is in moving from one narrative to another and never treating its audience like complete morons. the questions and mysteries of Twin Peaks might be almost too vague, but i don't know if that's entirely Lynch's fault. in the end i don't even know if that really matters, because a place like the Black Lodge is much like heaven or hell in that it's a personal metaphor - the only difference is that we've more or less been there. dreams were a centerpiece of Twin Peaks, they only have meaning through their interpretation, and they were some of the best moments in the show.



also kinda sad to see how much the cast has aged, especially heartbreaking were the log lady scenes. i'm very glad she was able to film some of her scenes before she passed, though.

Offline Bamyasi
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« Reply #15 on: May 25, 2017 02:16 AM »
Yeah FWWM is the thing I've most heard this compared to. Really need to watch that again. Don't even remember if I finished it the first time honestly. MGS2 is just one of the more famous "fuck you"s to fans in popular media so my mind always goes to that. I also like that we're not being treated like idiots. I don't think Twin Peaks' metaphysical mysteries were ever too vague as they were always grounded by a corporeal murder case, until the new season. They've really pulled the rug out from under us this time.

Goddamn that is a great fucking scene though. Really captures the surreal soap operatic yet literary/cinematic tone of the show at large. Actually teared up a bit watching it again, especially knowing Don Davis won't make another appearance. Didn't even know Catherine Coulson was dead. Fuck, this show feels more and more like a wake.
« Last Edit: May 25, 2017 11:44 AM by Bamyasi »

Offline rtil
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« Reply #16 on: May 25, 2017 03:51 AM »
yeah briggs was a goddamn great character, if only s3 had happened 10 or 15 years ago, but what can you do.

if anything FWWM was probably the biggest proverbial middle finger to Twin Peaks fans. i can't imagine what it was like in the early 90's being a twin peaks fan, finding out a movie is coming out after the cliffhanger, and then the movie reveals absolutely nothing about it. it's almost offensive to the senses, i mean there's a 15 minute scene where the voices are so drowned out that they put subtitles so you could understand them. i think unfiltered Lynch is a little much, but it has some brilliant moments like the framed picture and the ring, but then there's stuff that's really rough around the edges like the whole segment with Bowie.

you know something went wrong with production when fans recommend you watch The Missing Pieces to understand wtf is going on.

Offline Bamyasi
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« Reply #17 on: May 25, 2017 11:53 AM »
Yeah unfiltered Lynch really lends itself well to extremely banal narratives with horrific designs like Eraserhead and The Elephant Man, or more involved stories operating in part or entirely on dream logic like Blue Velvet and Mulholland Drive. Twin Peaks exists sort of in limbo between the two, where it has an extremely compelling and pretty straightforward story to tell but which also has metaphysical aspects and consequences.

I'm going to watch both FWWM and Missing Pieces this weekend probably. Have you seen the third and fourth episodes yet?

Offline rtil
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« Reply #18 on: June 13, 2017 01:18 AM »
WTF i love being trolled now



but in all seriousness i have seen 5 eps now and i'm still captivated. i know one of the major complaints is that "dougie" is taking up a lot of screentime with his slow-paced antics. for some reason it doesn't really bother me. i'm extremely amused by the way everyone around him reacts, wondering how the hell he will get through the day when he can barely remember how to go to the bathroom - piecing together what kind of troubled life the real dougie had, and how cooper is beginning to remember bits of who he is now that he's returned from the black lodge. and of course there's all kinds of bizarre shit going on behind the scenes and subtle moments that can easily pass you by. i'm already positive i will have to rewatch the series when it's over.

although my favorite moment has to be the opening to episode 3 when coop is visiting the woman with the missing eyes. i think i half understand what was actually happening there, but even if i'm totally wrong the way it was edited and the sound design was so surreal i was finding myself unsettled by the whole segment. something was just so horribly wrong - this distressed, mangled and isolated woman couldn't properly express herself, it was a trip straight out of our collective nightmares. and it all ends with a whisper from briggs, who we know is dead both as the character and the actor playing him. i know that coop is out of the black lodge now, but i really hope we get more glimpses into that world.
« Last Edit: June 13, 2017 01:20 AM by rtil »

Offline Bamyasi
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« Reply #19 on: June 14, 2017 06:01 AM »
What motherfucker has a problem with the "Dougie" bits they are almost uniformly the best goddamn.

My favorite segments are "Dougie visits the casino," "Dougie's morning routine," and "Dougie goes to work." Episode 6 has a particularly hilarious scene with his manager.

The only parts I still dislike and find betray the series' ethos are the horrifically violent bits, like the scene in episode 1 when the demon kills the couple, and in episode 6 where the woman is murdered with the
(click to show/hide)
Mostly for the fact I think they would be more effective had they been understated (a friend and I discussed how especially the demon mutilation would have been more effective had we only seen what happened immediately before and after, and the remains been merely a bloody stain on the couch).

This remains my favorite scene:


Just the concept of a man being trapped in hell for 25 years and returning to a life someone else had lived in his body, whilst suffering brain damage from the trauma of re-entering corporeality but still recognizing his biological son is one of the strongest and most poignant concepts I've seen on television.

woman with the missing eyes
Wasn't that supposed to be Josie Packard?