Xbox One

[psi43]

So, has anyone here watched the presentation? I sat through the whole thing and here's a personal little summary:
TV, TV, Television, TV, Television, TV, TV, Xbox One is rocket science, Sports, Sports, Football, Television, Fantasy Football, TV, Xbox go home, TV, HALO on TV by Spielberg, games which we won't show, Television with ipad, Kinect TV, Call of Duty, Call of Duty, Dogs in Call of Duty, TV.
So yeah, they basically introduced a ton of shit that SMART TVs could do for the past 2 years (and more efficiently probably, cause it doesn't need to go through the console).

Here's a funny summary of it all, which is very sadly quite accurate:
Xbox One Announcement - Abridged Version (VideoGamer.com)

[rtil]

i get what they're trying to do - a one-stop shop home entertainment system the entire family can use. microsoft doesn't think selling a piece of hardware in which its sole purpose is to play video games is a viable marketing strategy anymore. obviously they are wrong, but they don't seem to think so.

personally i couldn't care less, i haven't bought a console in over a decade and i have no plans to do so. i don't think it's a worthy investment seeing as not only do i play that many games, but i don't watch a lot of tv either, nor would i want to spend a bunch of time in front of my tv using various apps to do things on my tv that i can do on my computer (if i really wanted to.)

then there's the hardware specs, which, of course, are already outdated on the consumer market, and by the time it is released and selling titles will be even more outdated. but the tech demo of call of duty was a pretty bad example of what it's going to be capable of. still, the radeons they are packaging with the xbox one and the ps4 are considerably less powerful than the most popular card on the consumer pc market (660ti), and the cpu's are about half as powerful as intel's i7 line.

i just don't get why anyone in their right mind would purchase a next-gen console. with that money invested in the console, controllers, $60 titles, subscriptions and what have you, you could get a more powerful and practical pc.

[psi43]

you can not really compare consoles to PCs like that, it doesn't work. You have to understand that consoles are vastly different systems in themselves and operate completely different. That's why the term "gigaflops" is mentioned so often, because that's a somewhat more unified unit of measurement. The PS4 for example uses GDDR5 RAM for both graphics and processing. That's the very same reason why our last console generation lasted about a decade or so.

Either way, I agree with what you say mostly. Especially the first part; the thing they don't understand is that there already are devices (such as the SMART-TV) that already does things that their new system does - and better as well. The new consoles - both PS4 and Xbox One - seem to be a jack of many trades and master of none.

It's funny how the xbox and ps4 are trying to take over the livingroom as an all-around system, while the Wii U focuses on games more than the others (and the Wii U doesn't even have that great games).

[rtil]

they don't last because of hardware, they last because they're a long-term buy-in. you buy a console, you intend to get the most out of it. you're locked in, you're hoping for exclusives, things like that. console life cycles depend on a lot more than hardware.

i think it's perfectly fair to compare pc hardware to console hardware. they function in a similar fashion, they share the same types of hardware. the only difference is that a console serves a strict and unchanging function. thereby, it should be expected that they do that job better than anything else - but they don't.

to what limits will the ps4 and xbox one hardware be able to be pushed? only so much as the hardware allows. i get that they have to impose limits on the specs in order to make them affordable.. but actually, they're not. people who say they buy consoles because they can't afford a pc remind me of people who say they buy fast food because they're poor - they think they're being frugal, but they're actually getting ripped off and don't understand how to properly invest their money.

[Flash]

i've got a friend who has a large tv screen on the wall above his computer
whenever he wants he can just drag what he's seeing on his pc to the television and pull back his chair a little bit to see it. he can also use both screens and functionalities at once and play whatever the fuck he wants, console or not, while skyping - since at least a couple years ago.

nobody who's smart is gonna buy that shitty console unless it has some really kickass exclusives.

[soup]

yo i have always had consoles, because i was young and didnt understand computers

i didnt use half the tv linky features available on the 360 now. so wtf would i want with all the excess theyre cramming into this new one, just for it to die on me moments after the warranty expires

yeh i think ill wisen up and get a pc to take to uni

[psi43]

yo i have always had consoles, because i was young and didnt understand computers

i didnt use half the tv linky features available on the 360 now. so wtf would i want with all the excess theyre cramming into this new one, just for it to die on me moments after the warranty expires

yeh i think ill wisen up and get a pc to take to uni

well, it's not only targeted towards you, as a player, anymore. It tries to cater to families, gamers and basically just everyone, which makes it lack in basically every aspect due to that.

Also rtil, what I mean is that the architecture of the systems is completely different to computers. The PS4 has a quite similar architecture to PCs (programming wise), but it's still quite different hardware interaction wise.
What I meant with the consoles lasting that long was the ability to push the hardware so extremely far despite the extremely outdated hardware. The Xbox 360 can still SOMEWHAT hold its own compared to PC ports (like for Deadspace 3 or Battlefield 3). Of course there are compromises, but compare those games to the first few games that were released for the 360, there's miles between those in terms of looks. Due to the architecture of those systems (at least for the 360 and PS4) it was possible to push the hardware a lot more. You wouldn't really be able to do that with a PC that you bought 10 years ago and haven't upgraded since.

[rtil]

i don't know much about that, but what i do know is that the xbone will have many things a pc has - a bios, a kernel, an OS, and the hardware required to run those things all at the same time. i can't imagine it being too radically different in architecture that it has some major advantage over a pc.

i disagree that the 360 can hold its own to today's pc gaming machines. if you look at properly done ports, or just straight up pc launch titles, you can clearly see the downscaling involved to make it functional on the 360's old hardware. that, coupled with the fact that the xbox only supports a very small max resolution output by today's standards, there's just no comparison whatsoever. the 360 doesn't hold a candle to the processing power required to run modern games. battlefield 3 is actually quite a glaring example.

the fact that games look better on the 360 now than they did on launch is a simple matter of optimization. with better technology comes the ability to do more with less. i don't think it has a lot to do with 360 architecture - a console that has had many glaring issues in its lifetime.

[psi43]

i don't know much about that, but what i do know is that the xbone will have many things a pc has - a bios, a kernel, an OS, and the hardware required to run those things all at the same time. i can't imagine it being too radically different in architecture that it has some major advantage over a pc.

i disagree that the 360 can hold its own to today's pc gaming machines. if you look at properly done ports, or just straight up pc launch titles, you can clearly see the downscaling involved to make it functional on the 360's old hardware. that, coupled with the fact that the xbox only supports a very small max resolution output by today's standards, there's just no comparison whatsoever. the 360 doesn't hold a candle to the processing power required to run modern games. battlefield 3 is actually quite a glaring example.

the fact that games look better on the 360 now than they did on launch is a simple matter of optimization. with better technology comes the ability to do more with less. i don't think it has a lot to do with 360 architecture - a console that has had many glaring issues in its lifetime.

As I told you on skype, on a general basis I totally agree with what you're saying. But then again, the architecture of the xbox 360 allows the system to push its hardware more than a computer would be able to push it. That's basically the entire backbone of the console, longevity.
And yeah the xbone has a kernel, as well as an OS, but if I am not mistaken, so did the xbox 360 and the PS3 (I may be very wrong here though). Since their hardware was almost exclusively devoted to gaming though, the hardware was used a lot more efficiently than it was in computers.

but whatever, I still agree with you. I haven't seen much of the specs of the PS4 or XBox One yet (aside from the "rough estimates" of their Gigaflops), so I can't judge. The Xbox One seems to have a ton of shit going on at the same time, similarly to a computer, so the hardware implemented in that may not be as "tanky" as it was for the 360. As for the PS4, it's hard to tell cause they're using a completely new approach in terms of architecture; one that I don't understand at all tbh.

I guess we'll just have to wait and see.


that being said though, I sincerely hope that both the PS4 and the XBox One crash really hard and have barely any sales. The video game market with its ridiculous sales expectations have been shitting all over every platform for the past 2 years now. A crash like that would bring them down to create smaller games with more gameplay instead of cinema-like cutscenes again.. hopefully.

[rtil]

i dunno enough about the ps4 yet to say anything bad about it. but i can't imagine a press conference more devastating than the xbone. the xbone deserves to fail, and i hope it does. the ideas behind it don't respect the consumer at all and they deserve better.

maybe the console market does need to crash for them to learn something.

[psi43]

i dunno enough about the ps4 yet to say anything bad about it. but i can't imagine a press conference more devastating than the xbone. the xbone deserves to fail, and i hope it does. the ideas behind it don't respect the consumer at all and they deserve better.

maybe the console market does need to crash for them to learn something.

althout a ton of people will disagree with me, I feel like the PS4 conference wasn't much better. It was also about "connecting people" and a ton of things aside from gaming. Don't get me wrong, it had a lot more focus on gaming than the xb1 conference, but it was incredibly uninspired. The system itself is very nice with its PC-like architecture which makes porting games easier than it has been for any console before, but still. Both the PS4 and the xb1 try to compete to be in your living room, being your new remote control.

[Sinitron]

THIS SUX AND IS FOR FAGZ FUH Q M$ BILL GAYTES 69 PORNOMACHINE FUCKER AAAAAUUUGHHH HITLER HITLER HITLER HITLER DOG DICK EATER

i've been going sony since the ps1 and judging by current information i am not going to change that any time soon

however, that being said, i won't be getting a ps4 on launch, and the PS2 is still the best

sonic heroes is also a better game than sonic adventure

[bd648]

i've got a friend who has a large tv screen on the wall above his computer
whenever he wants he can just drag what he's seeing on his pc to the television and pull back his chair a little bit to see it. he can also use both screens and functionalities at once and play whatever the fuck he wants, console or not, while skyping - since at least a couple years ago.

your friend is a genius

[Gilthwixt]

Am I the only one thinking that the Wii U might end up having the advantage this generation, judging from what we've seen? I feel like most "hardcore" gamers and the older market will shift from Xbone and PS4 to PC, and the families and younger gamers will be playing on the Wii U.

I'm just basing this off my own experience, I haven't touched my Xbox or PS3 really in over a year other than to play a fighting game. Most titles get a PC port nowadays that is better than the console version. The exception of course is Nintendo stuff, and I feel like they're much more likely to sell consoles than any exclusives the Xbone or PS4 will get.

[zwimmy]

www.youtube.com/watch?v=fiBBqwwdpe8

[cipher]

I'm going to roll with psi on this one and say that PCs and consoles are getting harder and harder to compare. To me at least, it has very little to do with the actual processing power, and more the other features. Hell, simplicity is basically a feature, most people are not skilled enough to buy the parts for a PC for the price of a console and build their own. But I have no intention of debating this.

Anyways I think the Xbox One is doing something interesting things as an actual console, but Microsoft's shitty business decisions are going to lead to its downfall unless they change anything. Things like the inability to share games without having to pay, while an effective way to counter used game sales, is a choice that will just make people hate them more. And while it's not "always online", it needs to be online once every 24 hours to verify that the game you are playing is yours, so it's basically always online. It's bizarre and a bad move in general, especially how openly everybody has always hated this always online concept for the past few years. This is just the tip of the iceberg of course though. There's a slim chance there may be some reform between now and E3 (or it's launch), but I doubt it.

[psi43]

There's a slim chance there may be some reform between now and E3 (or it's launch), but I doubt it.

well, since it's a gaming console and most people here would buy it for gaming (if they buy it, that is), E3 may improve some opinions. They'll be presenting some games for it at E3 and if they're good, people will probably buy the system.

[cipher]

There's a slim chance there may be some reform between now and E3 (or it's launch), but I doubt it.

well, since it's a gaming console and most people here would buy it for gaming (if they buy it, that is), E3 may improve some opinions. They'll be presenting some games for it at E3 and if they're good, people will probably buy the system.

Perhaps. In all honesty a lot of people were pissed off that they didn't show many games at this press thing, but honestly I don't blame them. They were there to display the hardware, and if they talked about all the games, then they would have nothing left for e3, which is less than a month away

[psi43]

There's a slim chance there may be some reform between now and E3 (or it's launch), but I doubt it.

well, since it's a gaming console and most people here would buy it for gaming (if they buy it, that is), E3 may improve some opinions. They'll be presenting some games for it at E3 and if they're good, people will probably buy the system.

Perhaps. In all honesty a lot of people were pissed off that they didn't show many games at this press thing, but honestly I don't blame them. They were there to display the hardware, and if they talked about all the games, then they would have nothing left for e3, which is less than a month away

Yeah, as far as the presentation of the console goes, they did a good job presenting it. Sadly the thing they presented didn't seem to be good though. But yeah, let's just wait for E3.

[rtil]

Am I the only one thinking that the Wii U might end up having the advantage this generation, judging from what we've seen? I feel like most "hardcore" gamers and the older market will shift from Xbone and PS4 to PC, and the families and younger gamers will be playing on the Wii U.

this is already becoming a reality

[16:46:35] <@reptilicus> http://playeressence.com/amazon-uk-wii-u-sales-rank-jumps-by-875-following-microsofts-xbox-one-reveal/#idc-container
[16:47:01] <@reptilicus> heh
[16:47:02] <@reptilicus> heh
[16:47:03] <@reptilicus> heh
[16:47:05] <@reptilicus> consoles

Anyways I think the Xbox One is doing something interesting things as an actual console, but Microsoft's shitty business decisions are going to lead to its downfall unless they change anything.

no kidding
http://www.extremetech.com/gaming/139706-microsofts-new-kinect-patent-goes-big-brother-will-spy-on-you-for-the-mpaa